There's two types of people who hear consensual sales in the first go, Oh, Eww, Shawna, that is not what you want to say. There are better words to use and the second type here, consensual sales and say, you know what? You're right. I don't want to talk my way into the sale. I don't want to memorize a script. You just want to work with clients who are excited to work with you. Now that's consensual sales.
This is me and Melissa. We are just sitting here at the hotel. We thought, what the heck, we'll do another episode. But this one is going to be really special. This is going to be about moms and what it's like running a business with kids. So those of you who know I'm Shauna mom of five and Melissa mama for under four. Well, now they're five, four in four years.
(00:52): And we're going to talk to you about how you can do it, even if it's really freaking hard, it's going to be hard. It's going to be impossible, but you can do it, but you can do it. This is going to be the encouraging mom episode. Okay, Melissa, what's the worst advice you've ever heard to a mom about running a business with kids? Hmm. I didn't mean to put you on the spot. Not, I don't know. I don't feel like I've gotten a lot of advice because I honestly, I felt alone in it for a long time, because it seems like there's not many moms out there with a ton of kids close together, doing business. And I think it was more like this fear or this thinking that I put in my own head that I had to either be a stay at home mom or had to go to work.
(01:48): I couldn't be both. And what makes you think that? I don't know. I think my mom stayed home with us. Like she was a teacher, but she didn't start teaching again until I went back to school, like, or I went to school and I'm the youngest. So even though she was a teacher, she was home with me all the time because I would get off school and she would get off school at the same time and we would drive together. And so I don't know if I just like always felt and she's a wonderful bond. Like I love my mom. I have a great relationship with her. And so I don't know. I thought maybe if I were like, I had to be a good mom by being with my kids all the time. And I think it was a mindset I hadn't changed. So you're basically want to have your business.
(02:35): You want to do the design work, but you've got all these kids and you felt like you couldn't do both of them at the same time. Yeah. Or I couldn't do it well. So I was really career driven. Like I worked, I think at one time I had four jobs in college at once. And like I was the kid that I never went out and did stuff. I was just like working on my projects all the time and doing extracurricular stuff to make sure that my resume was going to be at the top of that pile. And I was going to get my dream job. Like I would like, you know, look on Pinterest of like all like how to decorate my office and like really, Oh yeah. How I was going to dress up for the job. And like, I was going to have this big corporate graphic design job.
(03:18): And then I got married a week after I graduated college to my high school, sweetheart. Hi chip. I love you. What's up chip. And I'd love you to listen to this episode. And we got pregnant like right away, like practically honeymoon babies. So within our first year of marriage and they were twins. Yeah. So thankfully I didn't know they were twins until 20 weeks along. I don't know what I would've done. Cause I was so upset. I was so upset. I love you tricking him. Right. But so all of a sudden, like my career driven, like dreams, like who's going to hire this pregnant chick who has like twins and is huge because you know, she's probably going to go stay home with them. Like, like who's going to hire that. So I was really eager to use my graphic design degree. And so you just said like, really, yeah, you just built up all this momentum to get a job and then start your career.
(04:22): And then it's just like, Oh, Nope. And not to mention, I went to this private Christian school that was like, both of us did. So we had this massive amount of student debt and we really thought we would be double income, no kids for five years. And then surprise, surprise. I brought the twins home on my nine month anniversary. They were born early. That's crazy. I didn't know they were born on your nine month anniversary. That's funny. Brought them home. So they were born like five days before that. Okay. So yeah. And then, so yeah, twins is hard and I'm not saying like it was easy peasy, but looking back when I was doing my business with twins, it was, it was a lot easier than having four. We went on to have another one, two years later and then another one, two years later.
(05:13): So my twins were four when I had my last one and there's been seasons like ebbs and flows of balance, like different balance between family and work. And I work primarily when my kids are sleeping. Like that's just a season of life I'm in right now with them all being so little and like very dependent on me. So my kids are great nappers cause they're like one and a half to five right now. Right? Yeah. So my youngest is one and a half and she still does like two, two and a half hour naps. And then my twins are the oldest they're five and they still need like quiet time. Like they don't fall asleep every day, but I'll typically put a movie in. And so they know that that's mom's work time. And I think it's, it took a while for me to understand that that was okay.
(06:10): Like as crazy as that seemed like, I felt like I had to be with my kids all the time. And if I was in my office while they were watching a movie, like that was bad and no one ever told me that and I don't even know where he got that. So for me, it's just been a lot of figuring out a loose schedule of one has worked time when I'm not working, what I can be doing with them. And then I think the question we always like as women, we feel like we have, I have to do it all. We have to have clean dishes, warnings, vacuumed, the laundry needs done. And like, if we're working, at least for me, I felt guilty if there's dishes in the sink and you have to get past that, like lower your expectations. You don't have to go to bed with a clean house.
(07:00): Kids are little and they can destroy the house in literally two minutes flat. So I, I figured out what I could be doing while the kids are awake and yeah. And including them in it. So I include my kids. I'm doing the dishes. I include them in the laundry. We make it fun. We do it together. And so that way, when they're awake, things are getting done, but I'm also spending time with them. And then we also chose to homeschool, which I know they're only in kindergarten, but I felt like it was the decision that forced me to like totally anti homeschool, like two years ago. You're like, I'm never doing it. Yeah. Yeah. That's a whole other story. Yeah. That's a whole other story. Like I, my husband's was homeschooled all the way up. He loved it. I was public school all the way up and I loved it.
(07:54): Anyway, long story short, my heart was changed and we chose to homeschool and I felt like that was kind of an excuse for me or like something that holds me accountable to spend that time with my kids every day, because they have to have an education. Right. Yeah. And so that's time that I can be teaching them and building relationship with them and school's getting done. So I don't even know how I started off on this tangent, but for me, it's just like, time management is like how I get it done. And it's not easy. Like there's nights. I don't go to bed till 2:00 AM in the morning. Cause I got to meet a deadline, but I also know they're not going to be young forever. Yeah. What has changed the most for you? Since the kids were like little babies? Cause I feel like I could never really relate to the mom advice about working when the kids were little, like when you have all these kids who are like little, like they can just run off.
(08:50): Like eventually they get to the point where they're like, okay on their own. But like, what did you learn between like little, little kids and then like little, big kids, little big kids are so much nicer. There's a little bit more freedom to like let them play. But when they were little, little babies, you have to give yourself grace. Yeah. It's not going to look like a perfect hour of getting things done. They wake up from their little nap early. They're hungry early. Yeah. And they might be sitting on like, I had this little pillow wedge when they were like really little and they couldn't roll over anything. And I have that on my big desk next to me. And I would like send emails or there's been lives where they start crying and I'm juggling them. And like, you almost just make it a thing of like, yep, this is life.
(09:39): Everybody knows it. This is my son Aiden say hi, he's going to do this life with me. There's something to be said about like your tasks changed. So like when they were little babies, I just like little, little babies or they're like brand new. I just focused on like expanding my network, expanding my network, expanding my network, expanding my network. And now that they're a little bit older, like I can focus more on fulfillment. Right. So like really getting, helping people get amazing results in the paid programs. Right. So it's like, they know I'm working in, so it's like a different type of work, even though it all has to be done. But like the ratio is different. So like you're just kind of like focused on different things where you have different levels of time. Does that make sense? Yeah. And like, I mean, for me, I was starting off my business at the same exact time.
(10:26): I had little, little babies, so I wasn't very far into it. So it wasn't like I had a ton of client work. It was more of me working on things to get my business to the next step. And I always thought that if I could just do 10 minutes, like that's enough. Like if I could just touch my business in some capacity, that will be okay. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot to say for that. I remember I would look around all these people who were seemingly just like growing their business exponentially overnight. And I would just sit there and I would feel jealous and be like, if I had eight hours a day, the things I could do and just like feeling bad for myself and just like, give me more time and I can do it. But there's something to say about dedication and consistency.
(11:20): And like you said, if you just touch your business for a small portion or one task, one little task each day and just like dedicating yourself to working on it, it will grow. But slow growth is still growth. And there's people that I would like be jealous of in the beginning that aren't even about business anymore. They weren't dedicated. And I don't even know if their growth was subs, like was you know, a, it almost grew too fast. Yeah. And so I think slow growth is still growth and you can't compare your story to someone else's.
(12:02): Yeah. It's like our goal isn't to just like help, like help you like explode your business growth. Our job is to help you stay in motion. You said that you want women and moms to know in particular that they can do it. What if they just feel like they can't like, they just feel like the kids are too overwhelming and they don't have the total support of their spouse. And like how stuff is just too overwhelming. Like what do you say to them?
(12:27): I would say that you're not alone. And I felt that more times than, you know, and I still have days like that. And there are days where I don't work. I've taken that when the kids are. And I think there's something to say about putting in little tiny strategies or tricks to help you. So like, look at what frustrates you the most. Is it the dishes? Is it that your kids can't get dressed without you asking them 10 times in the morning? So I know Shauna puts her kids. I'm their clothes for the next day before bed, because why do you need PJ's
(13:04): I think about that, like, why do we do
(13:06): The things we do? And if the reason is not good enough for you, then stop doing it.
(13:13): Yeah. It's sort of like, you have to get creative with the way, like we do things because that's how we've always done them. But when you have like kids and you have multiple little kids, the way that you do things, you have to think about them differently. So like for the example about clothes, like I put my kids in their clothes for their school clothes, like their normal clothes at like their pajamas or their normal clothes for the next day. Right. So that eliminates like having to put them in PJ's and having to get them dressed in the morning. This is also true with shoes, like the socks and shoes, getting those things on before we would leave errands was a nightmare. So now we all get into the car without shoes and then I can put their shoes and socks on while they're in their car seats or they're like already strapped in. And so that has made my life so much easier with my kids. Right. And so there's things that you can do that you might not have thought of if you just spend a little bit time thinking about, okay, like what is so stressful and how can I do it? Maybe just slightly differently. Yeah. And it doesn't have to be like this huge
(14:15): Thing. Something for me is I stopped buying. I got rid of all their socks that were like the designed socks. And I got them all white socks because I hate pairing up socks. And they would always like, not know whose is whose. And so that was just something tiny. And then dinner cleanup is like, I hate that. I hate dinner clean up because it's usually around the time where everyone is kind of like, like I'm done for the day. And the kids are kind of like at that hyper stage before bedtime. And so we started, like, I know that the three things that have to happen are the table gets cleared. The dish washer gets started and the table gets wiped off. Cause my kids are very messy eaters. So that was like always a huge chore. And so now we put on music and like, we all kind of do it with like blasting music and it becomes like this fun family thing.
(15:18): How has running your business and taking care of your kids, like made you a better business owner and a better mom? I think it's made me a better business owner because I've become, I think more relatable to a lot of people. I work with a lot of moms and then also just I'm able to give both my clients and me more grace. Like if, if my clients can't look at something today when it's due and like, they need to look at it, but they email me and they say like, you know, my kid has the stomach bug and I'll look at this like on Saturday, like that's cool. I get that same thing. Like I'm able to write that email when I need to and say, my daughter just broke her arm and I need a bump this date out just a little bit. And it's made me a better mom because it's forced me to really try to be present with them when I'm with them.
(16:19): And I don't do that perfectly, but no, I'm more aware of when I need to be doing better. I've sort of had this idea that the household stuff and the mom stuff gets really stressful because you never have an end in sight. So when you just realize like, you know what, I'll get to it when I get to it, it will be there again tomorrow. It'll be there the next day. Like you just had this kind of overwhelming sense of peace that sort of translates to your business because all of a sudden it's like, there's always going to be emails. There's always going to be work. There's always going to be hands to shake. There's always going to be offers on the table. Like you're never going to get to the end of it. And when you realize like, you know, if I don't get to today, like I'll get to it tomorrow.
(16:57): And then that brings you another level of peace because through the whole thing, you just, you accept that you're not going to get to the end and whatever you get done today, that's perfectly good enough. Yeah. And we said this a few episodes back how business comes through people. And there was a time in my life when I was, I was pregnant with my last and I had been in business for four or five years. She was a surprise. And I had that. I was done and I got really, really sick with her for like the first 24 weeks I was throwing up like every day it was awful. And I got into this really funky mood and I just did not want to work. And so I didn't. And I took, it was probably a good nine to nine months to a year where I really didn't do much but emails.
(17:50): I didn't really take on work. I didn't pursue work. And I'm not suggesting that, but I'm telling you that my business was there when I was ready to pick it back up, it didn't just disappear into thin air. I gave myself grace for a year. I was ready to give back when, after she was born, I think she was like four months old. And I needed that break more than I needed the word. If I had built my business on Facebook, advertising, nurturing my email list, which is all great stuff. But if I had only relied on that, I don't know how much of it would have been there when I got back. So I guess I'm just saying that to give yourself grace and know that there is seasons and the seasons change and it's okay.
(18:47): It is, thank you for sharing that. One thing that I like is that I like that my kids know that money comes through the effort. So like when they see me working or they see me doing stuff, like they know that's that's so we can live that so we can pay for food that so they can go to like pay for school stuff. And so I think there is something really valuable in letting your kids see you like work too. That I, like, I really find valuable. It's like good for them to see like moms working. Like this is how we pay for stuff. Yeah. I don't want them to grow up and be like, money just comes out of thin air. Like, it's like, no, like you actually have to work for things like you have to, you have to be a productive member of society. Like everyone things. And this is, this is how we do it. So I like that. I like that. They get, and I like to bring them apart into that. Yeah. Sorry. Am I getting tongue tied?
(19:36): I think it's so cute. My, one of my twins, she thinks I'm an artist, which is kind of drew. I feel like you like painting though, don't you? Yeah, but I mean, I like it. I don't know if I'm good at it. So she thinks I'm an artist, which is so cute. And she was like, mom, when I grow up, I want to be an artist. And she's actually gotten really, really good at painting and drawing. And it's so fun to see that blossom, but I was like, Oh, that's a, that's a great career. Like, do you want to, do you want to be an artist? You want to do anything else? Yeah. And I want to be a mom like you. And it's just like, it's really sweet. That example, like they watch you more than you think they do. And they're inspired by your work.
(20:20): It is a beautiful thing. I think it's important that we like rethink about how we do it. So like, it was so easy for me to put the computer, like in the kitchen or like to have my office in the dining room where we eat tea. Like, if you can just think about again, I guess I'm sort of emphasizing like doing things differently, but there's sort of these like rules that we think that we have to follow or just because it's always been done that way, that you can't ever change them or tweak them and adjust when you can. Yeah. And I don't want you to like come away from this episode, thinking that I have it all together or that we have it all altogether or that it's easy or that we're making it look easy because you just have to push through it.
(21:03): You have to know the days when you can push through it and know the days when you like need to go take a nap. And there might be a couple of days where you need a nap. There might be a couple of days where your kids sit and watch the movies. And there might be days where you need a friend like Shauna to call up. This is true. I'm be like, I can't do it. Like Hazel took off her diaper for the 25th time. And she pooped on the floor and the dog ate it and like, Oh my gosh, that actually happened. Did that happen? Because that happened to Jane once with our old dog. Yeah. It's happened multiple times, but you know, those days, okay. You need someone, you need to find other moms that are doing the same sort of thing. Like, you know, it doesn't have to be the same industry, but working from home or have their own business, whatever that can support you and get you through those hard times, because both Shauna and I have like had those days and like basically just vented to the other one.
(22:03): Yeah. There's something to be said about having, having a community of people who are doing what you want to do, where, what you are doing is like normal and common. And you've got that group of people in your corner. It really does make a big difference. Not only like in your business, but like in your marriage and then you're raising your family and faith stuff. Like yeah, absolutely cool. So speaking of like doing things a little bit differently, I was, I had a work call like just like a 20 minute work call or whatever. And Mary was a brand new baby and John had her and he's like out there, like holding her while I'm on the work phone call. And I can hear the baby screaming like a maniac. Right. And I'm on this call and I start like sweating bullets. And I'm like, Oh, this is so stressful.
(22:47): Like, I can't even concentrate on what these people are saying. So I put myself like shut off my video and I'm still letting on this phone call. And I grabbed the baby and I walk around with the baby. I, you know, I take the, well, I take the baby from John. John's like, no, no, like go do your work, do your work. I was like, no, give me the baby. Right. And I take the baby. And I like, you know, I walk around the house as I'm on this word call perfectly fine. Multitasking. And this could have never happened if I just followed the rules of like, you go into an office and you shut the door and you do the work like a man and you like, you can't multitask. You can only do one thing at a time. And it's like, no, I can take the baby.
(23:25): And I can be completely competent and aware of what's happening on this phone call at the same time. And so, I mean, maybe not a hilarious story, but like absolutely to the truth that you could do it, but you can't do it the way that everyone telling you, like you have to find your own way to make it work. And that means letting go of sort of like that fear of judgment of like, what are they going to say? Well, how's this going to be mad? Like you were whatever, you know, or these people it's like, no, like you can get the job done on your own terms. Yeah. And I think one nice thing about Corona and everybody working from home is that they're understanding that more like I've had phone calls with men recently. And I typically work with women and I always get nervous when it's a man, because I'm like, Oh, they're not going to understand it.
(24:11): They hear the kids, but they're like you a little bit. You're like, Oh, I completely understand. It's been like, I've been working from home. And it's been like, how? Like, they appreciate you more. My friend, John Buchan has said that if we like to think of business, like you're doing business with business or you're doing business to customer, but really you're doing business like human to human. And so we all put our legs into our pants each day the same. And so there's something to be said that is vulnerable when you get those calls or you're working with those people who are like, you know, I get it. I feel it's no big deal. Yeah. And I used to hide the fact that I had kids running around in the background because I was like, well, they're not going to hire me. Like if they hear that, because they're going to think I'm like not serious. Sure. Like that's proven to be almost the opposite. They almost respect you more sure that you're able to quote unquote juggle it. And a lot of, a lot of people are family people know they have kids at home with their wife. Yeah.
(25:20): All right. This is the mom episode brought to you by consensual sales, the podcast. If you want to take a deeper understanding until the consensual sales method, check out clients and money.com, it will walk you through the 3.5 part process on how to book, happy to pay clients and make more money without seeming desperate. We love it. We love that. No cost class, right, Melissa. We love it. Go do it. Yeah. Melissa actually designed all the slides and it's awesome. Thanks. You guys have a good night.
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