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A brand is an intangible marketing or business concept that helps people identify a company, product, or individual. People often confuse brands with things like logos, slogans, or other recognizable marks, which are marketing tools that help promote goods and services. We dive into what these intangible parts are and the impact they have.

Show highlights include:

  • How building a brand increases the value of your business and makes it way more attractive to potential buyers (7:49) 
  • Apple’s secret for dominating their industry even during tough times (and how to mimic this in your business) (10:22) 
  • Become an expert at what you do and then you become passionate about broadcasting it (15:10)
  • The “Expert Secret” for never needing to sell someone again (15:34)
  • Interview prospects and choose the right people to work with so you can avoid high-maintenance clients who give you endless headaches (17:55) 
  • Failing is ok…it’s healthy (even if failing makes you want to give up) (24:38) 

If you'd like to check out Ted’s magazine, you can find it here: https://www.buildmagazine.com/. And you can tune into his podcast, Friends of Build Magazine, here: https://www.buildmagazine.com/podcast/  

To get the most out of this podcast, or connect with Duane and Dave, head over to https://buildernuggets.com and join our active community of like-minded builders and remodelers.

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So I sat there and I thought to myself, wow, what an impact, not smiling had

Welcome to builder nuggets hosted by Dwayne Johns and Dave young. Hey, our mission is simple, build freedom. We are a couple of entrepreneurs turned business coaches who have dedicated ourselves to helping our builder remodeler clients create the most rewarding businesses in the industry. My co-host Dwayne has been a successful builder and remodeler for over 30 years. He's seen the highs and the lows. From the beginning though, Dwayne has been on a quest to find a better way to run a contracting business. In 2016, he found that better way. That's how I met Dave, a lifelong entrepreneur and visionary who measures his success by the success of those around him. He reached out one day with a formula on how to transform my business and the rest is history. Since then, we've teamed up to help hundreds of contractors like you build better businesses and better lives. Now we've decided to open up our network and share our secrets so we can start moving the needle with you. It's collaboration over competition. Each week, we bring together industry peers and experts who share their stories so that we can all build freedom together. .

(01:10): Our guests today has been publishing magazines for more than 25 years. In 2016, his team had an idea they would call build magazine. The intent was to inspire wealthy people that were looking to build luxury home. They started in bend Oregon and now have a presence in luxury. Second home locations, all across north America, places like Jackson hole, Naples, Scottsdale, Hawaii, big sky park, city and Whistler. Just to name a few, his clients are some of the best in the building industry and their images will motivate anyone to want more. It's my pleasure to welcome president and CEO of bill magazine, Ted brain bridge to today's show. Welcome Ted. Nice guys. I'm excited to be on the podcast with you. Yeah, definitely glad to have you. And you know, I was thinking about bend Oregon. JWE flew several builders, including myself out to bend Oregon. I wanna say it was back in 2000 to tour their plant, have some fun out there. And we did, we had an absolute blast. I mean, from snowmobile in the cascade and exploring some of the high desert, that's a really cool place.

(02:07): It is a really cool place. There's no doubt about it. Everybody that comes and visits, visits us. They're like bend Oregon. Where is that? And I grew up in Canada, originally, not too far from Dave, a town called Oakville Ontario. And so my brothers and sisters would come down or we've got a business up in BC and the gala works with us up there. She'd come down. It's like, oh, bend Oregon, whatever, whatever, whatever. And they come and they go, this is beautiful. So thanks. Yeah, it is. It's really cool place. So Ted, you and I met not too long ago, it was at the international builder show in Orlando. We had a chance to chat. I met your lovely wife. We hung out together. We of the group of builders for, well, frankly for some late evenings, that was a ton of fun. It was. We certainly, yeah, we certainly hit it off right away through our discussion. We found that you were actually dipping your toes in the podcast pool as we have been over the last year. Yes. So why don't you go ahead and tell our listeners a little bit about, about yourself, your background, you know, why you're so passionate about what you're doing in the magazine?

(03:06): Well, so it's been an evolution. So build magazine came about as my wife and I built three custom homes in bend Oregon. And the last one we built with a guy named Jim za from PAC west homes. And I actually did a podcast with Jim and his wife on Friday, which is up on our website, bill magazine.com. But I went to him and I said, I've got an idea. We've been publishing tourism guides since 1995, started in Vancouver, sold a company in 2000 and moved to the states and moved to Oregon in. Now. Now we live most of the year in Scottsdale. And in the summer times we still go to Oregon, which is where my office is, but I went to Jim and I said, I've got an idea to create a magazine, to inspire wealthy people, building a renovating expensive homes. And we only bought the A-list of people in the trade.

(03:55): So we didn't want any of the box stores. We didn't want any of the production builders. We just wanted the cream of the crop. And he said, Teddy, I love the idea about how you gonna make sure you don't have a box store in there. I said, simple. We're gonna do it a hundred percent by referral. So the only way somebody can be included is if one of their peers says, go and talk to. So and so and so and so, and that's how we built the whole thing, because I was still doing market research. I went and talked to the lady who owns all the Sotheby's offices is in Oregon, her name's Deb tubs. And she's an incredible lady and a real inspiration. And I've admired her for 20 years. And I said, there's nothing to buy. I've got an idea. I wanna know if it's a great one or a lousy one.

(04:34): So poke some holes in it. Let me buy you lunch. And within five minutes she goes, Ted, where's your rate card. I wanna advertise that's my, I said, you can't. My buddy owns the jewelry store in bend. He's got a Rolex is one of his lines and he wanted the back cover. And I said, no, and I don't know why Dwayne. I said this initially, but I just decided we were gonna stick very tight to the high end building trade. And it served us so well. So we started in bend. Then we went up Tolo BC, which is where our Canadian company is. Now we're in Whistler, big sky. You know, Dave, you, you touched on a bunch of the high points. I'm gonna be in Palm beach next week, as we've got, we're launching a magazine there and it's just different. And we don't put a bunch of miscellaneous stuff in there just cuz somebody will write a check. We don't care. We just stick to our guns. And that seems to have made a difference. And the podcast has kind of piggybacked all of it off of all this. I've listened to several episodes now. You're certainly having some fun with that. How's that going?

(05:36): It's been quite a whirlwind. So we started the podcast cuz one of our clients down here is actually building a house for us in Scottsdale, getting Brad Levit with AFT construction, a finer touch. He's got a podcast and I think he's done about 175 episodes. And he said I, I was golfing with him last year and I go, Hey, should I do a podcast? And he goes Ted with the clientele you've got, I think it would be a fantastic idea to do a podcast. So now once a week I talk to the leaders in the industry all over the continent about not only what's going on in their business, but more importantly about the American dream about the fact that anybody, if they've got an idea, they can make it. And, and my, as this thing has evolved, my strong motivation is to take the younger generation who I truly believe they either think opportunity falls in their lap or their dis chanted and just have given up because they don't think the American dreams alive and they couldn't be further for them. Truth. I think the opportunity is stronger now than it's ever been, but you gotta work for it. You gotta work hard and you gotta, you gotta hear nose. You gotta get punched in the face. You've gotta, you've gotta lose a lot before the, the taste of victory is so sweet.

(06:59): Yeah, no doubt. You and I talked about that several weeks ago, you know, the brand and how important a company's brand is. And I think that gets, it gets lost sometimes in what, what is the meaning? It gets thrown around since you and I talked about that and you know, thought man, what a great topic for the show here. I, I, I went online a little bit just to see what you can up with. And of course, if you ask several different people, you'll probably get several different answers around what a brand is. But one I came across that kind of resonated with me was it said a brand is an intangible marketing or business concept that helped people identify a company, product or individual. And I think people confuse brands. You know, they confuse it with logos and slogan and you know, other marks that they might recognize with marks and things. And those are more of the marketing tools, gimmicks sometimes. What is your perspective on what a brand is and why that is so important?

(07:49): A brand is critical to the long term success of any company. When you build a company and you then want to go and sell it, or you wanna transfer it to your generational businesses are super hard because they don't have the vision of the owner. But when you build a brand, it's your identity of who you are as a company, it's your company culture so that you can take one person, one key member out of that company, the company still survives because the culture survives. And so as things get tougher, people will still wanna gravitate towards brands because they become a little bit more cautious with their money. And it's not that they're looking for a better deal. They're looking for the safety deal. So they don't want to take a risk on, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna hire this. Renovator because you know, his price was right.

(08:49): I wanna hire this renovator cuz I know they've got a good name and that they're gonna get it done right. The first time, especially in renovation or home construction, there's nothing worse than trying to sit. We all want a good deal. All of us. Right. But there's nothing worse than, than taking the lowest bid and then not having it done. Right. And now you're staring at it for the next five or 10 years. And it just aggravates you, you every day, it's kinda like buying the pair of shoes because it was such an awesome deal, but the shoes are a half size, too small. So you never were. I would say, as you move up in level and you move up into more, you know, high end projects, even into luxury products and that kind of clientele, I mean, I would think that brand becomes even more important yeah. To the client

(09:34): And look, look at all the big brands that are out there. You know, I always talk to my clients because they're so busy right now, Dwayne, that they don't need any more business they're drinking from a fire hose. It is just craziness out there. Supply chains obviously are issues. There's a bunch of things that are being thrown at us. I mean, could you imagine, would you have ever in a million years that people would be building five and 10 million houses and having to put in a white fridge in order to get their occupancy certificates? Because the stainless steel fridge that they ordered is back ordered for the next six months. Not only are they spending a ton of money, probably more than they should. And they're tolerant of some of this stuff. It it's, it is quite a bizarre time we're in right now.

(10:20): It is a bizarre time, but they, they just, that's where the safety of the brand comes in because you look at apple, apple still market themselves. And is there a better technology company in the world? Is there a brand that, that would there be person in the world that doesn't know what an apple phone is? You know, I been Africa, but I gotta believe that even the people in Africa would know what a apple phone is. And yet you continue to see them market themselves and keep their name out there because it's all about the power of the brand. And even if it is more expensive, that's they embedded in people's minds that, well, you know what, it just works And it just works.

(10:57): Yeah. Kind of what you said, it's, it's a less risky purchase. Well, you said something earlier, which is, which is about the culture that you wanna build and ultimately your culture becomes your brand. And that's what you're talking about right now. And I think a lot of people try to figure out what their starting point is like what, what do I wanna build and what do wanna amplify? And you gotta start with your culture and build your, your brand around your culture instead of the other way around. And that's kind of what you set out to do. You had a target audience and you're like, these are the guns that we're gonna stick to. These are the principles, this is a culture that we wanna have. And ultimately that became your magnet for people who believed in that and wanted and wanted to do that audience.

(11:36): And it's so powerful to think of in the construction industry, when you think of how many different influential audience types there are, it's, it's not just the clients that you wanna win and attract. It's the top project managers, it's the top architects, it's the top realtors. It's the top trades and suppliers. Because as you talked about with the white fridge, you wanna have access to resources. And how do you give your advan those advantages to your clients and to your team. And that's by building an undeniable culture and then finding a way to have that voice stand out in your message and marketing. And that's how you create your brand. And that's, that's exactly what you're doing. So have, have you got any advice for people who are, are trying to look to, Hey, how do I amplify my brand? Or what, how do I, what do I need to do to cultivate that?

(12:26): So there's, there's two things that you just said, Dave, that I, I wanna touch on. One is I've gotta run innovator in bend, Oregon. And I phone 'em and I go, cause most of our clients, we only do the magazine once a year, but they commit for three years. Cause it's all about that stability of the brand. Cause there's nothing worse than any business to kind of be a hodgepodge where, where they see you somewhere and then you're gone and then they see you back and they go, there's no consistency. So it makes people nervous. So this guy I've known him really well. And he had serious surgery where he had a growth on his spinal cord. And the doctor said, you have a 25% chance of walking outta this hospital. And he sure enough, he walked out. So he got lucky. So I'm talking to him and I've known him now for several years and I go Hey, do you what do you wanna, do you wanna, what you wanna renew?

(13:19): What are you thinking about? He goes, yeah, you know what? We're not going to, and I didn't wanna push this guy too hard because of his personal situation. And I go, no problem. He goes, yeah, you know what? We've only gotten one job that we can account for this in three years. And he said, my boys have taken over the the remodeling business. And so I, I didn't push it. I go, okay, no problem. I, I said, but just understand when you're working with me, this has zero to do with you. Having somebody pick up the phone. Cause most of our clients are so busy. They don't want the phone to ring, but they need that consistency and elevation of their brand and credibility with their company by being associated with the other A-listers in our magazine, he goes, no, no, no.

(14:09): He goes that's a good point. I get it. He goes, but we're gonna, we're gonna pass on this here. I said, no big deal. Literally a week later, my phone rings seven 30 at night and it's Dave. I go, Hey man, how you doing? And he never phones me. And I kind of figured something was up. And he goes I just want you to know, we, we just had a meeting, my boys and I had a meeting with one of the bigger builders in town and we're looking to do a bunch of their finishing work and their stuff for them. And the builder asked us for, okay, what gives you the credibility? What, you know, what have you done? The whole platform idea? And they pulled our magazine out and they said, well, here, here we are. And they go, okay, that's what we wanna see.

(14:52): And it was just because they were associated with the other top people in the industry. And so he phoned me and he, and he told his boys, he goes, we gotta be in Ted's magazine. That is exactly what he was talking about. And the other part of that story is when I was talking to our builder, Jim yo, when I was doing the podcast, we were talking about a variety of things. And then he talked about passion because Dave, you also mentioned this as well is where do you get? Or maybe Dwayne, you asked me the question, where do you get the passion? You know, I, I see it in my own kids in their 28 and 30 and they've got good jobs, very good jobs, but they don't necessarily know what they wanna do. Or we hear stories about kids that are 25 that don't necessarily know what they wanna do.

(15:38): Right. And it's like, well, what am I passionate about until you become an expert? Which is probably the most important thing that I could relay to any person is whatever you you're doing, become the expert. And when you're the expert, you have passion and you're, you start to geek out on those little details and then it becomes less of, well, I've gotta sell you in order to get work, to pay the mortgage or pay for my car. And it becomes more about advising people because you're the expert in that field. I'm the expert at what I do. I can help people at what I do. I could not build a house to save my life. Cause I don't know the, the, the structure, I don't know. I don't know how the workflows, I don't know you need to do this so that you're creating building blocks. Cause I'm not an expert.

(16:29): Well, you never have to pitch either. You're always the buyer. In, in that case, you're always the key decision maker. And you're deciding whether or not you want to take this job or whether or not you want to hire this particular architect or hire a particular project manager because you have choice. You've created a magnet and a brand that other people wanna work to that they believe in. You believe in it. So why would you settle for anything less? Cuz it's only gonna diminish your brand, but you have to get there. Like what are some of the key things that you have to do? So we talked about building culture. You talked about consistency. We call it creating some predictability in your business. But what are some other nuggets that you could lay out there for accumulating this brand status and, and recognition. So

(17:12): First and foremost, there's no sure you gotta work your butt off. You know, I, I was telling Dwayne, I think you weren't on the call yet, Dave. But I was telling Dwayne, we saw a or I listened to a podcast with kid rock yesterday. Kid rock gets to work at three 30 in the morning and he's the last one to leave the studio at six o'clock and he works to please himself. And he knows exactly who his audience is. That's another key point is how many times do you ask somebody? Well, who's your customer? Who's your client, who's your audience? And they go, well, everybody, no, it's not everybody. There's certain people you, you wanna work for. And there's certain people you don't. So to your point of what you just said, Dave, which is really important is when you're dealing with anybody and I don't care what the product or service is, you should be interviewing that person as much as they're interviewing you regardless, it could be selling a car cause you don't wanna sell a car.

(18:09): That's gonna be high maintenance. You don't wanna build a house for somebody. That's gonna just be contrary to your personality because now you're in a, a year and a half relationship and it's gonna be murder the whole way through. So you've gotta have enough confidence in yourself that you have something to offer, but they need to make the, the customer's not always right. It's easy to go. The extra mile for somebody that you truly think has got your best interest and consequently, you can create your best interest for them. Yeah. If that makes any sense, Wanna level up, connect with us to share your stories, ideas, challenges, and successes. The building nuggets commute is built on your experiences. It takes less than a minute to connect with us@buildernuggets.com, Facebook or Instagram, want access to the resources that can take you and your team to the next level. One call could change everything. Yeah. I think a lot of businesses, especially younger people, you start your business out of necessity, your everything to everybody. Yeah. And in some ways you kind of have to, but you know, the businesses that, that really become successful and that thrive are the ones that very quickly realize they have to become more niche. You know, they've gotta understand what their market is, who, what type of product service they're delivering, who their client is. And I think the, the quicker you can do that. And the more you can hone in on that, the more successful you're gonna be. Cuz I totally agree. Especially in this, in this industry, you just can't be in everything to everybody. You can't cover the spectrum on price points and sizes and types of projects and, and quality. There's just no way you can do it.

(19:45): You know, it's, it's kinda like there's something deep, very, very important that everybody needs to know. It's more important to know who you aren't as opposed to who you are. That's not us, that's not us. Well, we don't know who we are, but we know we're not that. And I think, I think you, you just have to define what you are and who you are. And to a degree, you gotta tell you make it. But once you know who you are, makes it super Easy. Well, and then your clients can't talk you into being somebody that they want you to be. If that's not the route that you want to go, because that oftentimes that's what happens is you come up against a powerful personality that's persuasive and you find yourself trying to Abend to accommodate somebody. And then you end up down the road. This is somebody that you could never make happy that wasn't valuing you and wasn't valuing your team. And as a business owner, you owe it to protect your team from circumstances like that, because you wanna have project manager, burnout, pick bad clients, pick the wrong people that don't value them and what they do. And you're, you're down a path. So how do you involve, you know, in the best businesses that you've worked with, how do you see them involving their team in building the brand and building, you know, it's one thing to say, you know, you get everybody together and you build this culture. What does that, what that look like? How do you, how do you seek team members positioned in your, in your magazine?

(21:11): I see them and I wanna back up just for a second, cuz you mentioned something. And, and when we went to with build magazine, we had no idea. You know how when you start, whether it be, you start a, as a building contractor and you start with smaller houses, entry level homes, first time home buyers. And then you start to elevate yourself up and ratchet yourself up a notch and then another notch and another notch. And you're kind of refining your skill and redefining who you are. So when we, you make decisions along the way, and sometimes those decisions are bad decisions. And sometimes you look back and you go, they're great decisions. One thing I'm constantly telling, not only our clients, but also our team as well as my kids is, don't be afraid to fail. If you're not failing, you're not trying because not every decision you buy a stock and you go, this is a home run.

(22:08): I, I bought a lot on the river in 2007, this was a no brainer. Downtown bend. The price was right and we lost our ass. And so something that you think is a no brainer, just through bad timing, doesn't become a no brainer. So when we decided that we weren't gonna have realtors in there, we weren't gonna have jewelry stores. It kinda, we didn't, I didn't know. It truly came outta my mouth and I really, I hadn't bought into it completely, but I had a, a pretty good idea of what I wanted. So then we did these mountain towns like Jackson hole and big sky and white fish and Cologna and band. And then we go to Naples. Well, we're not an east coast company. I'd never been to Naples before, other than to drive through from Tampa to Florida to go to the next hockey game.

(22:57): And I've got a partner in Whitefish, his daughter lives in Naples. He goes, Ted, we gotta do a magazine in Naples. It's off the charts. And I go, okay. So he sends me the other magazines from the area, these interior design magazines, they're all 300 pages are beautiful. I go, well, we're either gonna get slaughtered or we're gonna crush it. And we went and talked to the biggest and I'm not gonna mention the woman's name, cuz she gets embarrassed every time I do it. But her one question was a paradigm shift for our entire company. And she goes, Ted, where'd you come up with this idea. This is a brilliant idea. And I go, I thought you were gonna laugh, fit me. Like I'm some hillbilly from the west coast, cuz everything you have here is magnificent and it's white and it's big and it's beautiful and it's expensive.

(23:41): And she goes, what you don't understand is the other magazines. They're all lifestyle magazines. We don't really care about, you know, this story about this person or that person. She goes, what's unique about yours is you didn't sell out. You just cuz somebody would write a check realtors aren't in there. We like that. Jewelry stores, plastic surgeons. They're not in there. We like that. And then she said, Dave, she goes, the person who owns in Naples has a place in Kansas city or Chicago or Columbus. They also have a place in Jackson hole or big sky or park city. And I go, of course they do. So those are the things that you just have to have trust and belief. There's no shortcuts and don't be afraid of the down times. Don't don't go, oh this is so crappy. This is so lousy because think of your own lives, the best stories that you tell are the ones where you can't believe how you figured it out. And that's a great term. You gotta figure it out. Well

(24:40): That's trial and error, right? So if there's no trial, there's no error. And then there's no success. And people confuse trial and error with mistakes or failure. It's not, there's always going to be error with trial. The only time it's a mistake is if you keep doing the making the same one over and over again and you don't grow or you, you, you quit trying, right? So building it's, it sounds like building a brand is, you know, building you your authentic voice, your authentic brand is a little bit of that. And it's like, you put a nice bottle of Cabernet away and it will change over years. It's designed to change over years, it's designed to mature, but you gotta do the right things. You've gotta have it in the right light, temperature controlled. You're turning it, all those little subtleties that will, once you have the experience and, and you know what you're doing, that you tweak the model and you, and you mature it and then you're able to replicate it because now you have something that you're able to take into any luxury market and let's face it. Most cities nowadays and or resort communities have a luxury market of of some kind. Yeah, you've obviously, you know, you've gotta great clientele, some, some pretty special brands from the, the custom builders remodelers that you're working with. Give us quickly maybe, and you, you don't have to go in and name names or anything, but just from the ones that you work with, tell us some similarities around the ones that, you know, have those really great brands and then maybe even some of the differences.

(26:05): So the similarity is there can consistency with their culture. So it doesn't matter who I'm talking to. If, if, if they are a great builder or a great interior designer or a, a great brand like Wolf subzero or pillow windows. And, and I just grabbed those two outta, you know, not trying to pigeon hole but you and their process is so smooth. Their customer service is so smooth. I'll give you a good brand. That's not in the building market, but we all deal with on a regular basis as Costco and I had this conversation with somebody just the other day, you go take something back at Costco. They don't ask you any questions. They just take it back. And whoever the distributor was is part of their deal is they have to take it back. You go into total wine, the customer service and total wine.

(26:59): It's a fun environment you want. I, I truly believe leave that if you can make doing business fun for people, cuz there's too much negativity in the world with social media, there's too many people offering opinions on too much stuff that really, we should just kind of stick with our lane. And so I just think if you make it in an enjoyable experience and when you're building a house, it should be fun. Everybody says it's a so stressful. This is our fourth house. It's fun. There's a lot of decisions. You guys earn your money. There are so many decisions and also having professionals around you. So we're building this house in Scottsdale and we've got an interior designer, a builder and architect, and they're a great team together and they're all into Penant. But boy, I remember when we're looking at having the interior designer and just the fees involved in the interior designer and it was like, oh, just cuz you just feel like you're getting nickled and dimed. Everything's another couple of thousand or 10,000 or 20,000 and you're building this house. And as soon as we move the decision for the interior designer, she has done such an incredible job that it was once the money was spent and you realized the benefits of the service it's made the process so much smoother and more enjoyable for us

(28:19): That that's so interesting. You know, whenever you walk into a well designed house thing is if it's in a luxury market, it, it adds hundreds of thousands of dollars to the feel when you walk in yeah. And cost like a fraction of that, the return on investment of that, cuz nobody ever walks into a home and goes, oh my God, this place looks so sensible. I love it. They just go, you know, wow. And a return on investment, but you're talking about the total wine experience, you know, mixing fun, positivity, putting that into your, putting that into your culture, a culture of celebration instead of denigration, cuz we're seeing so much of that judgment right now, but why not just celebrate wins and work internally on the stuff that didn't go right? Or share the stories, Hey, this didn't go right. And this is what we did to, to fix it.

(29:10): But yeah, the constant judgment out there that that takes away from any experience. One thing we haven't touched on yet though, and it's, it's part of the, of the, how you present yourself in terms of your level of communication, the refinement of your brand and those sorts of things. One of the things that things that struck me when we met you and I got to hold, you know, the box that your magazines came in and see how the whole thing was presented together. And that's you representing your brand, that's a tactile experience for your audience. And I, I think you probably see that across the board in some of the, the premier level builders that yes, it's, it's one thing to, to use the top level of fit and finish. And you talked about, you know, PE and Wolf subzero and, and all those other things. But it's another thing. Well, Dave, that's actually, that's where I was going with my original question with the disparities, but then the differences, you know what I mean? That, so yeah, there's like those common, fundamental things. People can do the consistency things for make a great brand, but then there's the differences, the things that make you unique and things that you might do as Dave would say, and then whether it's in presentation or communication. So yeah. Would love to hear what some of those unique things that you've seen.

(30:20): Well, it's a harder question to answer because we've all heard that you can take a CEO from one company and put him into another company. And so I'll use a hockey analogy and it's not a perfect scenario, but Lou Lamarre who built the New Jersey devils and now he's rebuilding, he fell the lease. But I don't think that was Lou Amarillo. I think that was the, the owners. And if you don't have ownership goes a long way, why is it that the green bay Packers are always at the top of the heap or Robert Craft with the, with the new England Patriots, you look at 'em and you go, they're always winning. And obviously in, I don't know the ownership of the Tampa bay lightning, but John, Cooper's a great boss behind the bench. And I just think if you look at those things, there's continuity.

(31:11): I don't necessarily look at what makes 'em different because they're all people I just look organizationally at what instills leadership. Okay. I'm, I'm gonna share a story with you. And this is once again, not in the building industry, but I got a really good buddy of mine. I'm actually having dinner with he and his wife, Les and I have dinner with them tomorrow night and his name's Gary fish. And he started a brewery called Deschutes brewery, which is the fifth largest microbrew in the us. And I think he's got 550 employees and they're in ever now. And he started it in bend in 1988. And it was as a restaurant in a brewery and he didn't really know what he was doing. And he was, I think he's the second brewery in bend. And now he's just a, he's, he's a big deal. And I remember golfing with Gary 20 years ago when we moved to bend and I said Hey Gary, you've got some of incredible people that work for you. What do you find about them? And he goes, well, they don't always make the decision that I would make, but as long as their heart's in the right spot, we just go with it because I can't be everywhere. I can't do everything. We just go with it. We're gonna make mistakes. But if our heart's in the right spot, you just, you suck it up in the idiot.

(32:27): Well then that's that culture thing. You know, you got a strong team, you got a strong culture. A lot of those things are gonna figure themselves out. Yeah, you gotta, You gotta let them lead you once in a while too. And, and know that they'll lead you down the wrong path every once in a while. But like you said, if they had a good reason for going down that path and their heart was in the right spot, you gotta let 'em have that. Because if you take that hard away from them, they'll be afraid to lead you anywhere. And you'll be an autocratic company and you know, not be able to grow anywhere. You know, I looked at leaders that are best ones that I've seen and they're not afraid to hire people that are smarter than them. They don't have to be the smartest person in the room. And oftentimes the smartest people in the room are scared to death to do anything on their own because they're afraid they're gonna fail. And yet that's not. And I just, once again, have this conversation with, with my kids and one of our team members is, is don't be afraid to be challenged by the people in your organization. That's how you make your organization stronger

(33:29): And yourself too. Like Dwayne and I have said on the show before the best leaders will accept leadership. I mean, that's an amazing quality of them. They're willing to be led. And we don't have time to get into lead versus managed cuz that's a, that's a whole different topic. But yeah, if you can create that culture of leadership where everybody leads each other, everybody's looking out for each other, everybody's listening to each other, amazing things will happen. And that's how, that's how the voice of the company develops over time. That's how the, the business matures and the message matures, the clientele, matures everything, and you create something enduring Ted. As we ask all of our guests, what excites you over the next six months to a year? What do you have in the pipeline what's coming up for you?

(34:13): Well, what excites me over the next six months to a year is just seeing the what's happening in a, our country and feeling like we're starting to get back to some sense of normality and hopefully having some sort of a sense with the supply issue pipeline, hopefully getting that sorted out a little bit so that our, our builders, our clients aren't as swamped as they are right now because I think there's great opportunity there. I think we've learned quite a bit coming through this pandemic about what's really important to us. And what's important. Overwhelmingly is family and staying, you know, we've heard the term nesting, but staying closer to home and putting more value in our kids. I love the fact, the parents are more involved with their kids now because parents are the ones who should be encouraged in the destiny of our kids. Not outside factors. I'm a very, very, my wife and I are very strong, active parents that have taken our kids to they've been to 49 states. I've been to 10 provinces, we to five con continents. So we are very, very much a part of their life because I think that that's a healthier environment.

(35:30): That's cool. Well, we've enjoyed having Yon and you know, the magazine is fantastic. Thank you. Glad that we can collaborate together for folks that are listening. If they wanna learn some more about you or connect, how can they find you Go to build magazine.com or friends of build magazine podcast, which is on Spotify, Amazon, Google, anywhere you can get podcasts Looking forward to it. Yes. I am slated to record with you in On the 30th, right? A few Weeks. I yeah, on the looking forward to that, That'll be awesome. And Dave, before I let you go, two things, one is, if you haven't watched the Danbury trashes on Netflix. Yeah. I've seen it.

(36:08): You have wild, wild. Okay. Second thing is you talk about getting your nose broken by some guy I played golf a couple of weeks ago at yeah. And he goes Teddy. He goes, I just, I still love to fight. And he is Brad's 50 or 52. He goes, I still, I love to fight when I was playing and I still love it and he's not a goon, but he was a tough dude. He's, he's tough. And I've played with him in charity tournaments and he's smiling the entire time and ins charity tournament, not, not much ever happens, but right. You, you know, you just see the, the light in, in the eyes and, and some guys they'll, they'll look away and other guys, you know, you just got that shitty grin and it's like, half the time that'll stop the fight. Right. Yeah. Right there. Mayday is such a blast. And sometimes, sometimes when I, when I play with these hockey players, you know, it's their business and they get worn out by people asking 'em a whole bunch of questions I played with he and I Al IRA. And they were just talking the entire time about hockey and we all love it and we're all fans of it. And so they were totally cool with it. Yes. Awesome. He was great with the Leafs too. Awesome. Defensemen yeah. Yeah. He all right. Okay. You guys. Thank you.

Hey, thanks for listening, Dwayne and I love hearing from you. Your stories are inspiring and your challenges can be overcome. Got a cool tip idea for a show problem that you haven't been able to solve, or maybe just struggling to figure out what you need next and where to get it. We can help hit us up@buildernuggets.com and start building freedom.

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