Welcome to JaysMastermind.com podcast. The only show in marketing that couldn't care less about your fancy little feelings. If you're a smart internet marketer, that's serious about success, then put on your big boy pants and enjoy this episode with your host, Jay. [00:20.0]
Jay: Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, this episode we teased ya, hopefully will please ya. We are talking about Stupid Stuff Marketers Say, one of my biggest frustrations that I talked about, I believe in episode one was for the platitudes. I don't like dealing with platitudes. Platitudes is all the stuff that sounds nice, but at the end of the day has no substance. So let's actually go through a couple of them. It's going to be a little bit controversial because some of you smart marketers. And I say that with quotes, not like the good one, like we did in the last episode. The people who think that they know and never actually do the ones who has every book, every course, pretty much, you're a, a human meme of every marketing gear out there. This is for you. I want to try to kick over some of your sacred cows. And here to help me do a little cow tipping, to rinse the poop of the cow patties off my boots, it's none other than Jonathan, how you doing, man? [01:34.0]
Jonathan: I am afraid. I'm afraid and excited. This is what I was waiting for from episode one.
Jay: Yeah, this one, I think this is one that I was the most excited to do because honestly it just gives me enough sound bites that I can actually split up and actually utilize. I'm just really hoping that it's going to come across as good as I hope it does. I do have just a bunch just off the top of my head that I just kind of did as some notes here. And again, if you have any other ones that you personally are just tired of hearing, please comment at them in one of the formats, whether it's the iTunes or whether, what do you do? You send us out to like about seven, 8,000 people or places Jonathan, the TPF does?
Jonathan: Everywhere. Yeah anywhere you can find a podcast; you're going to find Jay’s Mastermind.
Jay: Wow. And how much of that is actually required on my end.
Jay: Yeah, it's actually zero. That's the reason why you pay people. [02:33.0]
Jay: Find people that are smarter than yourself and just pay them to do the hard work. That's the reason why I look. I can technically cook ramen and eggs, but I Door Dash. You know why? Because they're better at it than I am. I could technically do my laundry and make my bed, but that's why god invented women anyway. Sorry, let's go on to this one. I'm starting to feel it, this one is unofficially by Diet Canadian Dry. You know; if you work for them, try to get me a sponsorship. I doubt it would happen. I do not think that this is a brand that you probably wouldn't want to associate some, one big like Canada Dry with, but it is diet and a lot of fat people right now in COVID, I am one of those. I'm up 25. but Stupid Stuff Marketers Say, let me jump in here because I'm getting extremely ADD. I need your help. [03:23.6]
Here is one, that it sounds so good. And honestly, look, I think I've mentioned a couple of times Frank Kern in these episodes like them or not one, his wife is hot, so he knows what he's doing. That should tell you, he's able to do great copy and a great salesman. But I actually do like the guy I'm not actually subscribed to his list because of actually one of the reasons on this, there's only, I think two lists that I'm subscribed to outside of Jonathan keeps sending me updates via Facebook, which I love. They were actually really helpful. But I think he's the one that popular or popularlise popularized it. There we go. I can speak good, but it's the people and just go in and fill in the blank if you know it. People only buy from people they “know like, and trust.”
Jay: Was that was that Dan, Dan Kennedy?
Jonathan: Is it? I don't know. KLT
Jonathan: everybody said something about that [04:27.0]
Jay: Yeah. Well, I know, I think of, from my earliest time, I remember when this first came out and people were like, Oh, that makes sense. And I say, it's out of hogwash. I used to believe it. I used to believe it, but it actually leads you into a trap if you're not smart enough to actually get the reason why people say this. I know this actually came from essentially, I think the origins was like a Zig Ziglar quote on the sales, like how to be a great salesperson. It said something, something to this extent to where Jim Rohn, which is kind of a famous kind of self-developmental guy that also did a lot of sales training and personal development and stuff like that. He kind of popularized it, which I know that Frank Kern was actually a big follower of. And I believe is actually in the mask control, the original mask control product launch just whenever I heard this and everyone now, everyone is just like, Oh, people only buy from people that they know like or trust. And it's just literally a hogwash. Most of the time, then again, talking about platitudes, people are like, all right, well, how do you get people to know like, and trust you? And then the follow-up is usually we'll just find a market and give them a bunch of free stuff until they like you. That's horrible. [05:36.1]
Jay: Yeah. It's true. It's true. And sometimes so that's the reason why it's again, another one that we haven't, or is the fortune is in the list? The fortune is in the list, we've heard that a bazillion times.
Jonathan: Now, but what you described there and you know it, when you start giving people a bunch of free stuff, it's it actually makes them hate you.
Jay: It does. It makes them have no respect for you. Because again like that, the free stuff, moving the free line, all of these types of stuff, that's what I'm hoping to kind of uncover, right. So if we go back and then I'll drill down, because I think I actually have all of those on the list. It's think about it this way. Amazon, you know of Amazon. Do you know Jeff Bezos personally? Do you know him?
Jonathan: Oh no.
Jay: Do you like him personally? Maybe. I mean, he looks like a freaking beast now.
Jay: Like that, all of those billions, all those billions like as like, I don't know if it's steroids, like what it is, he's a freaking beast. But he's the reason, also think about this. He's also one of the owners of was the WaPo, Washington post and extreme liberal newsletter. So for all your Trump supporters out there that still buy from Amazon, you hate everything about this guy, everything and what he stands for. And guess what? You still buy from him, all of the made from China stuff, because you get two day free shipping. [06:54.1]
So that goes to show you that you don't have to really know anyone personally. Because this was initially designed and created for face to face salespeople. These are salespeople that are most of the time selling or trying to convince people to buy something that they didn't even really have a need. It was commodity. Right? You go, I mean, technically you can argue the case, the reason why you need life insurance, but do you really have to go door to door, praying on like, you know, seventy year old women's like, Hey, let me show you why you need the life insurance or do door to door. I actually got my star one time. I'm the most horrible guy, but actually got my start one time in the whole sales aspect, going door to door, selling vacuum cleaners. Can you imagine me that that was horrible? I would knock on it. I'm just like, I would just looking at them, I'm like, I don't want anything. I would just turn around. [07:41.1]
Jonathan: I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
Jay: Yeah. I was just like, I just, they had the look. I don't want to deal with you and that's just not some people do. Right. So that's the reason why it's really think of the reason why these things exist. You know? And I think that was really the big point in the episode one where I was just like so many times you see the offers like, Hey, buy my super fancy duper free traffic method, that'll get you to a bazillion dollars. All utilizing free traffic. And it's an ad, you know? And then trust like trust. Well, yes. I mean, you don't establish trust by giving away free stuff because every woman listening, if there are any women listening, try giving, you know, giving away some free stuff to most men and see if they trust you after that. No. See if they like you after that? No. Well, I mean, they'll like you after 2:00 AM, but that's about it. They might even know your name, like at least your first name, but that's about it. But Amazon, it cannot really right. Apple, everybody knew Steve Jobs was the biggest dick in the world. Most people didn't like Steve jobs. Apple's one of the biggest companies in the world. [08:47.0]
What about breaking it down to some mom and pop, a septic tank cleaners out here in Kentucky. I say, Kentucky it because I hate everything about this place, but Kentucky, they have a lot of septic tank cleaners. Do you judge your ability to get your poo working correctly based off of well, do do I know like or trust a septic guy. I know when you have poo all over your yard; you're going to do whatever it takes to get that poo off the yard. Again, platitudes. Focus on providing solutions to problems, that's literally all you have to do. No lack of trust. Don't give yourself away. Again, the fortune is in the list, fortune is not in the list. Fortune is actually in the responsivity of the list, but more importantly, the fortune is in the list of people that pay you so many times and there's actually popularity or popularized by lead funnels. Specifically with the Ryan Deiss landing page on lead funnels is everyone was going Gaga over like a 70 plus opt in rate. [09:57.5]
Jonathan: Oh yeah, I remember that.
Jay: Yeah. 70 plus opt in rate, everyone was going Gaga. Well, guess what? I used to run marketing and lead pages. Most of that stuff was actually done to an internal warm list and most of the whole pages that they say this landing page was utilized, you know, get the group on landing page. That's actually how they got their start, is here get this group on landing pages that had like this 300% leads. Well, they never did it at the height of their career or at the height at the time before they got a VC funded, they were averaging like the lead pages that was developing all of the criteria, the marketing collateral that everyone in the internet marketing community was going Gaga over was making 20 to 30 leads per day.
Jonathan: God grieve. [10:41.0]
Jay: I think my, I think my NDA is expired. So if not, then I'll deal with that later. But that's the thing. There's a lot of things that lead into that, right? Like basically getting 72% opt in rates to people who are actually already on your list and you just send them an offer for another free thing, you know? It sounds good. So now everyone was chasing that and there is like, well, what's the key to doing that? Well, what did he come out with? He came out with a training on how to get a 72% opt in rate with a thing called, what does he call it? A lead magnet, lead bribe.
Jay: And it it's one of those things. He was utilizing the matrix to actually pitch a product, but people were believing on the matrix cause he could technically show the matrix, but not really the source of the matrix. Right? So the fortune is in the list. Honestly, if you're at a 70%, do you know what I honestly tell most people, if you have a higher than a 20% conversion rate on your, your opt in page, guess what I tell people? Charge for it.
Jonathan: Interesting. [11:41.8]
Jay: If you have your traffic and your offer so dialed in that you're getting an obscene amount, like again, 20 to 30%, the numbers always make more sense. Put 10 bucks charge something for a dollar, $10, whatever is. I always say 10 bucks cause I'm like a dollar is just not really worth my time at that point. You know what I'm saying? But at least that $10 at the front end, even if your opt in rate at that point in time or your conversion rate goes to a quarter of what they are talking about specifically for non-warm traffic, non-people that are not on your list. So cold traffic people, this is how you scale up. Well hands down, always be a lot more profitable because you're getting front end revenue front end money. Plus the responsivity. Is that a word responsivity? Anyway, it's a word I'm coming up with, of the people that pay you something goes from an average open rate or engagement rate of 7 to 15% to 50 to 70% on average. [12:49.6]
Jay: So a lot of people that are giving away these free stuff, building up these free lists, forget the fact that having a big list doesn't make you the money. It's the responsivity of it, right? So then when you actually look at the cost per lead on the people who actually ever opened your emails at that point in time, you're looking at it two to three times the cost CPL, because again, you didn't go through and do the smart principles of actually setting up the proper measurable or trackability of it, which if you don't know how to do that, then just go to JaysMastermind.com, get the billion dollar framework, it's in one of the courses. But making somebody work for it, you see this in relationships all of the time, making somebody work a little bit harder for it, they value it a lot more. [13:33.9]
If you're an online marketer, who's tired of struggling, tired of the BS and tired of buying course after course with nothing to show for it. Then the choice is clear, go to JaysMastermind.com and grab your copy of the billion dollar framework today. [13:51.6]
Jay: A guy will probably never text you, if you give it up easily, if you make him work for it, chase it you'd be surprised what you can get out of the dude. What did Amazon do, where Walmart used to be the biggest game in town. It was always about this price drop. Let's get like as low as possible in the price and just go for pure volume. Amazon came out and said, I'm going to charge you for the right to give me money. But as long as somebody didn't understand it, I understand now because I mean, it's like the two free shipping, all this other kind of stuff. And there's a lot of free stuff that they actually catch you on and utilize in sales, but it's not, they don't lose any money on it because of the distribution. They got to a place to where their numbers in their funnels are so tuned in that. Yeah, they can technically say free two day shipping, but they're not losing any money on it. [14:40.1]
And that's really the only time that ever if you're starting off you charge, even if you're good, you charge. There's a very few times, unless you have a proven sales cycle that you should not charge upfront for a, an opt-in lead, right. So stupid questions about tools. And I'm going to go through the other ones. Cause I just want to ensure that we get stuff in. You'll hear it all the time. Which tool makes you the most profitable? You know, like what email provider should I use AWeber or GetResponse, which one's going to make me the most money? Should I DropFunnels or should I use ClickFunnels? Should I do WordPress? Or you'll see it a lot of time. What's the cheaper alternative to ClickFunnels or what's the cheapest hosting and how do I get a free auto responder? And here's the stupid thing that's, anything about tools, marketing tools, not a single marketing tool makes you a dime. Marketing tools are a potentiator of profits. It's not the cause if you can't make money off of a two, was it 250, $300 ClickFunnel subscription, you're not going to make money because you switched over to a free landing page service provider. [15:43.2]
If you can't make money off of a $19 a month, AWeber, you're not gonna make money because MailChimp offers you what 50 for free or something. I dunno. All tools, all services are a potentiator profits, not a cause. Did that make sense? Did that come across?
Jonathan: I've never heard it put that way, but it's, it's perfect.
Jay: Yeah, cause you see it all the time and well this is cheaper, right? Again, you're you're thinking it's never the cheaper aspect. I put my back against the wall. Most of the time now I go out there and I get the most expensive because it forces me and I give myself a certain period of time. I get the most expensive. It forces me to say, look, I have to turn profitable for the business. Or I now am facing this amount of debt. You know what I'm saying? That's my personal thing, I don't really recommend anyone do it. I just have a lot more risk tolerance and generally smarter than most people listening to this. So another stupid thing people say is name your traffic method, whatever it is. And then followed up by is dead, email marketing is dead. Have you ever heard of that one? [16:50.9]
Jonathan: Every day.
Jay: Facebook is dead. Oh, PPC like Google, Google search is dead. All of the stuff it's dead. And it's like, no, it's not that it's dead. Is that most consumers are tired of your half-ass attempt at marketing. Email marketing isn't dead. But my, my opt in rates in my, my engagement in my click throughs and all this kind of stuff is, you know, it's down to single digits and I used to have a 50%. Well, no, maybe that's just an indicator that people are, have heard your pickup lines once or twice. And now guess what? They're not that amused. Maybe just the way that you're doing it is dead, but it's still incredibly valuable. So offer value, you'll see this a lot. And I think that we touched on this which usually gives away, well, you know, find a market and offer them a bunch of value. Your, your income is only proportionate to the value that you put into your marketplace. Well, no, it's not, you know. Again, there's a lot of value is the perception of what something is worth, right? [17:48.1]
So we about it a little bit in other episodes, but again like where everyone was trying to get into the e-com game and be the cheapest price possible, Amazon said, Hey, how about for you to give me money, you also have to give me 80 books a year. They came out as a wow, I got to pay you for the right to give you money. All right, there's something Apple, same thing where it's like, hi, how cheap can we get the phone productions? Now for a phone every year you have to upgrade a thousand dollars. Is it better? I mean, you can read the specs. You know, it's not that based to perception of value. They built a brand over, you see the Apple, you know, this person has money and it feeds into a whole other type of stuff. But again, a value is all perception. Sometimes instead of again if you want somebody to value, the free information that you think is so good charge for it. Charge 10 bucks or hell, what if you did your free report and you put a $97 price tag on it, it'd be an interesting test. I guarantee you, your conversion rates are going to go down, but I guarantee you, the people that actually pay a hundred dollars to get that same report on your list is probably going to be worth a thousand times more than the freebie seekers on your list right now, worth the test. [18:54.3]
If you're not testing, you're guessing. One that actually to get frustrated about is information overload or overwhelm. And I'll put on here, most people aren't overwhelmed with tasks, but overall I'm thinking about task. I'm like this with housework or back whenever I used to do it, it's I would think of all the different rooms I'd have to clean and all this stuff. And I would just sit there and I was like, ah, I would just watch Netflix and my house was a wreck. It was, but what did my mom always say? It's just, if you have to clean the house to start cleaning. Most of the overwhelm that people feel, if you actually, and this is a coaching advice that I've gotten and that I've given hundreds, if not thousands of times, it's right. Why don't you write on a list everything that you're saying is you have so much stuff to do. Alright. Write it down. Okay. Now once you have it on paper, you see actually it's not really as big as I'm not really that much stuff to do. And then once you follow it up with a smart principle, doing exact KPIs or doing that methodology, you'll find out, all right, well, what is the profitability of that particular task? If there's no profit to be had, if there's no profit to be had then crossed off your list. [20:03.3]
But again, a couple of more, because I know we're wrapping up on time. So, but overwhelmed thinking about tasks. And I think that's really where I was locked. Cause I'm a chronic over-thinker and that's where like, again, just write it down. Should I outsource it? I don't know. Write down everything that you want outsource justify it against the smart principle against the profitability of your business. See what happens. Another thing I hate people that ask for pre advice, cause it's a false positive. It's like, you'll see this in a lot in the, like the copywriting groups. If you're aware on that on social media, you know, it's like, Hey, well somebody would like to review and critique the sales page I just had. Well, at the end of the day, the biggest critique is going to be getting that copy in front of some cold traffic and seeing how it converts. Everyone else could put their own spin on it. But at end of the day, test it against your market cause that's the only thing that really makes sense. Or there'll be like, what's the best lead source for XYZ. [20:55.2]
Well, the best that’s stupid cause you have a bunch of people that don't know what your market, that, that hasn't went through the billion dollar framework. I'm trying to tell you how to get more clients doesn't make any sense. I guarantee I hate guarantees. I would say don't take on the responsibility of people's lack of effort. The truth is, and this is what I try to teach my kids that the honest truth about most humans is that the best part of them ran down their mama's leg. So quit offering guarantees anywhere you can. Like if you go out there and say like, look, I guarantee you're going to accomplish XYZ, then for ad compliance, you're going to have to offer a 30 day money back guarantee. But you can say like, look, this is how I did it. Chances are, you're probably not going to, because you're not going to put in the effort required, but I, at least I could show you how. There's a lot of honesty into that and I think it's a lot refreshing. You gotta Zig where other people zag, right? [21:42.6]
And then the last one here, then I'll wrap up. Cause I know we're coming up on time and I'll let you throw kind of your 2 cents in there if you, if you want Jonathan. But again, you're, you're taught a lot about become the market authority of the guru. The world's best, right? You need to be able to do that, carve out your niche and become the world's best at it. So then people go out there and you'll see it all the time. People mark themselves as the world's best this and that. And the age old saying is if you have to tell people what you are, you're not. You're the best in the world at what you do when people actually call you the best. You're not, if you're the one calling yourself the best. If you're the world’s greatest kisser, because you said so, you're not. If everyone in town says that you are, then you are, if you're, if you're the world's greatest copywriter, cause you said so, you're not. If everyone else says you are, then you are again like your old pal, Ben Settle. I think he does that, like the world's number one copywriter or email marketer. But guess what if he said that didn't really buy him, take him serious. The fact that you look at the people on his site that says he is I'm going to listen to this guy. He's the one of two lists that I subscribed to. [22:53.5]
So focus on solving real life issues and let them market give you the authority. Don't go out there and try to claim through marketing your authority. Go out there, be real, quit falling for the high solve real issues and guess what? That's how you become the market. Don't chase guru status because those who chase being a guru is never the guru. So with that, I take a rest. Do you have any 2 cents that end there, Jonathan? [23:20.3]
Jonathan: If you have to say it, you ain't it.
Jay: Yeah. If you have say it, you ain't it bugger. I have to watch how many times I say ‘ain’t’ because like coming in from Kentucky or I'm not from Kentucky, but living in Kentucky, I gotta watch it because before I say “can’t”, then all of a sudden you say stuff like “Worse” and you start talking like your cousins and stuff. It's just weird.
Jonathan: Do we have a teaser for next time?
Jay: We do have a teaser. And the teaser is it's probably going to be my favorite episode that we have recorded up to this date because I think it's going to be a heck of a lot more actionable than anything that we've done up to this point. So the teaser is that you must subscribe to that because I'm not going to tell you what's coming up. It's going to be my personal favorite out of the 10 that we recorded. So that is the teaser.
Jonathan: JaysMastermind.com to sign up. Another episode is in the can get smart people.
Jay: Get smart.
Jonathan: Get smart.
Jay: I like that, get smart
Jonathan: We'll be back in your ear buds next time. [24:24.2]
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