Welcome to the Masculine Psychology Podcast, where we answer key questions in relationships, attraction, success, and fulfillment. Now, here's your host, world-renowned therapist and life coach, David Tian.
David: Welcome to the Masculine Psychology Podcast. I'm David Tian, your host.
This episode's all about how to access your natural attractiveness in a way that's actually good for your mental health. What I'm saying is that not only is your hidden true self naturally attractive, but that there are also parts of you that are naturally attractive. [00:40.0]
Now, if you're listening to this podcast because you went online and searched for dating advice for men, I'm going to assume that you are not currently naturally attractive enough for the type of women that you're going after. Or maybe you're currently in a relationship that is lacking that passion or that deeper connection that maybe you had or had the promise of during the honeymoon phase or period at the beginning of the relationship, but now it's kind of gone stale, and you're worried that maybe it's because you are not attractive enough or that you are unable to attract her the way you did at the beginning, so you clicked on this or you've found this podcast. Or maybe you're just interested in this because of the title or because you want to help a friend. Whatever it is, I'm going to assume that the situation is you are not naturally getting the type of attraction that you'd like to.
What the dating gurus online are telling you is that you have to be different from how you currently are, and they're going to give you tips and tricks and strategies that will force you to put on a fake persona or a false self in order to pull off these techniques smoothly and efficiently so that you're not trying too hard, because trying too hard will undermine any attractiveness that you might have gotten from any technique. [02:03.7]
But the idea is that you're supposed to get good at these techniques or tactics or whatever that they're teaching you, and in order to do that, you're going to have to internalize it, assimilate it in such a way that it makes you different, your personality or your thought patterns or behavioral patterns, in such a way that now you've put on a fake or false self.
And wouldn't it be better if you were able to just access parts of you that are already naturally attractive that you just haven't been able to unleash, or a naturally attractive true self that you haven't been able to access, rather than having to force fit some cookie-cutter kind of false-self persona that you learned online with millions of views? Which, supposedly, that means, if this were something that they could implement, there would be millions of the same dude out there doing the same type of thing, and then your uniqueness is gone and it's not really you anymore and it's definitely not natural. [03:02.1]
Now, your first impulse was right that there's something you're missing, but the thing that you're missing isn't “What techniques or strategies or tactics should I use in order to manipulate a woman into being attracted to me in the short term?” or, even worse, to pull it off in an efficient way to put on a false self. That's not what you're missing. What you're missing are the naturally attractive parts of you. So, right from the beginning here, I want to dispel the myth that you have to become someone you are not already in order to create or find a loving relationship.
Now, if what you're after is to sleep with as many women as possible, which would require you to have lots of one night stands because time is limited, if you want to maximize the number of sexual partners, you're going to have to be more efficient with getting onto the next one.
If that's what you're after, you probably shouldn't be listening to this podcast, but maybe there's a part of you and maybe your real self that suspects or knows that what you really want in the long run is a loving, committed, intimate relationship. And if that's what you're after, there is a natural way to do it that doesn't require putting on a false self. [04:17.0]
In the previous episode, I pointed out the long-tail effect, where it's better for you to be more of yourself, to put out more of your unique quirkiness or your unique personality, in order to attract, if what you want is to attract a long-term relationship, and now I'm going to go a step further.
Now I'm going to point out that if you're not already naturally attractive, that not only should you be more of yourself, but that there are parts of yourself that you're not even in touch with or that you don't appreciate, and that you haven't accessed your true self, and that once you access your true self consistently, you'll be able to discover and appreciate those parts of you that are already naturally attractive. [05:01.1]
By being with those parts of you, understanding them, spending more time with them, appreciating them, they'll become even more attractive through a natural process that's authentic to you—and it's authentic because these parts of you are unique to you. These are your subpersonalities and your true self, and it's natural because these parts of you already exist in you.
Though they may be repressed or serving roles or playing roles in your internal system that are unsuited to them, and while the process is authentic and natural, it doesn't mean that there won't be any work in the process. So, this would be a good opportunity to dispel another myth that's especially prevalent among millennials and younger generations that hard work is bad or negative, or shouldn't be there.
Hard work, in and of itself, is neither good nor bad. It depends why you're working so hard. If you're doing it because you're tortured out of fear and insecurity, then, yeah, that's not mentally healthy. But if you're working hard because you love it and you're putting a lot of effort into it, that sounds great, and in fact, hard work can be enjoyable when you're in flow. [06:15.4]
In fact, flow, the state of flow, requires challenge, requires, includes as a necessity, hard work, and entering that state of flow consistently is not just necessary to being attractive naturally, but it's also necessary for your happiness in the long term.
Now, if you don't know what flow is, this is such a well-established concept, it's pretty much uncontroversial and it's been in social psychology. You learn about it in social psychology 101 and university, and it's been a part of general knowledge for at least the past couple decades and maybe even 30 years depending on what your reference group is.
Okay, so there is going to be required some effort and, at the beginning, in the therapeutic process, which is the process that you'll need to go through to discover, access, appreciate, and unleash, in the sense, the naturally-attractive parts of yourself and your true self, you're going to need to go through this therapeutic process, at the beginning, there will probably be resistance. [07:15.8]
At the beginning, it'll feel like you have to put a lot of effort into sustaining that state or that concentration of being with your emotions and not fleeing to your typical coping mechanisms. For a lot of my type of clients that come to see me, they're high achievers and they're generally pretty intellectual, so one of their coping mechanisms is thinking and analyzing. They just start talking, and that's something that I did and I had to work through that, and it took me about a year, year and a half, to get to the point where I could consistently stay with vulnerable emotions long enough for them to reveal themselves and progress through the process.
Looking back, I don't consider that hard work, because you're still doing the same thing for the rest of your life, but it's so much more enjoyable, and it's just like learning anything else as a learning curve. At the beginning, the learning curve is steep because you're just starting out, and the whole sort of structure of it, the feel of the activity is really new, so it can actually be really exciting. [08:13.2]
But only if you lean into it, that is, I'm trying to prepare you for it so that you expect it and expect that it'll feel challenging—you might consider it to be hard work. You might even find it to be uncomfortable. Good, those are all good signs—that means you're learning something new. That means you're acquiring new mindsets and skills.
But keep in mind that this whole process is natural, because what you're simply doing is getting to parts of yourself that have been repressed or disowned, or exiled or forced into unnatural roles in your life, as a result of fear or trying to maintain or get certainty or significance in ways that have neurotic and no longer serving you, and you're coming out of your comfort zone, the thing that you're used to doing, which isn't working very well for you, if you're listening to this podcast and you're interested in this topic. Right? [09:06.0]
The good news is there are parts of you that are already attractive. If you are able to just access and unburden them and unleash them or express them or embody them in your body, towards the later stages of the therapeutic process, it will become very natural and enjoyable for you to allow these parts of you to express themselves out in the real world.
Okay, so let's get into how this works. How can you do it? How do you do it, David? I've actually covered the early necessary stages of the process, and I call this the seven steps, and I’ve dedicated an entire podcast episode to explaining the seven steps and giving it to you step by step.
This process is based on IFS therapy, which is an evidence-based practice listed in the National Registry of Evidence-Based Practices in the United States by the United States government. But these seven steps are my own way of ordering how it's done. [10:01.5]
The first step is discover, which is to discover the parts of you that are in a protective role, what are called protector parts. The second step is to access, which means to access enough of the energy of your true self, which in IFS speak is called self-energy. Okay, so the first step is to discover your protector parts. The second step is to access your true self or enough critical mass of that self-energy.
The third step is to befriend, which is to befriend and understand these protector parts, and the fourth step is to what I call trust, which is to build trusting relationships with your protector parts and that takes time. I point that out because a lot of people who come to the process are driven by an agenda to fix themselves so that they can finally get some other goals. They have this agenda, and if you come to these parts, any of your parts, with an agenda like that to get them to do something or to fix them, then it'll warp the process or the parts won't be honest with you and they'll just feed you what they think will get you off the back. [11:08.2]
So, that fourth step of trust, building a trusting relationship with these protector parts, cannot be and should not be rushed, and sometimes it could take a year or years building trust with your different parts that are protecting the more vulnerable ones before they will authentically allow you to access to go onto the next step, which is to work with the vulnerable exile parts.
So, that's the next step. Unburden, I call it, which is to unburden your vulnerable exiled parts that are being protected by these protector parts. The protector parts are the ones that are out front, usually are interacting with other people or just representing you in the world. They're the ones that take over when you're at work or when you were at school, or deal with your day-to-day kind of recurring situations, like hanging out with your friends and that sort of thing. [12:01.4]
Generally speaking, you've got protector parts, what IFS calls manager parts, managing your day-to-day life. But then there's another category of protector parts that come in once something has been breached or once you've been triggered. But once you access some kind of painful emotion, then these other more extreme protectors show up that in IFS speak are called firefighter parts, and they show up and try to put out the fires of the pain that have now come up. Once you get triggered, the managers aren't able to manage the situation anymore, and you have parts of you that are more extreme and they come out in anger or lash out in some way, or might engage in some harmful behaviors or maybe just distracting behaviors.
We don't have to get into the specifics about those two different categories of protector parts. What you just need to know is Step 5 is to unburden, and you can't get to unburden the vulnerable exiled parts and you can't get to the exiled parts safely until you've built trusting, authentic trusting relationships with the various protector parts that are arranged around them. [13:04.6]
Okay, so Step 1 is to discover your protector parts. Step 2 is to access enough of the energy of your true self. Oh, by the way, if you don't know what the true self is, this is a term of art in IFS therapy, and your true self is full of confidence and courage, and sees the situation with clarity and is able to be calm, and is connected or seeks connection with your various parts, is fully compassionate, is able to access creativity, curiosity, and has a kind of playful presence, and is patient and persistent.
IFS posits that we all have within us, all of us have within us, that true self that's capable and naturally is those qualities, and what the IFS process helps you to do is to first access that higher self, the true self in you—and that is my Step 2, to access enough of the energy of your true self. You just need enough to get going, and then as the process gets going, you generally will get more of that self-energy. [14:12.1]
That step, Step 2, is also one that you should not rush, and if you rush prematurely, you can actually damage, you can re-traumatize yourself. You can damage the system. So, this is really such a delicate process that I do not recommend people do some kind of self-therapy without having done some kind of private therapeutic work with a good therapist with the IFS process, because it's still a relatively fragile and delicate process—especially Steps 2 and 3, where you're accessing enough self-energy, where you're befriending your protective parts, and then, of course, Step 4, which I mentioned, building the trusting relationship.
Okay, so you really want to lay the groundwork with the first four steps. Then you get into Step 5, which is to unburden, to contact and unburden the vulnerable exiled parts, and that can often be done. If you did the first four steps correctly and really took your time to do them properly, then Step 5 can be relatively quick. It can happen within an hour or it might take a couple sessions, but that's relatively straightforward because you've laid the groundwork, the foundation, in the first four steps. [15:20.0]
Okay, then after unburdening, you have Step 6, which is to integrate. This is to integrate your newly unburdened parts into your system, and now that these vulnerable parts don't need protecting anymore, and these protective parts that had been doing all this hard work to protect them—through achievement or through walling up, or through an avoidance strategy or whatever, maybe even an anxious strategy, whatever it is—now they don't need to do that.
It takes them a while for that to sink in for them, and then they'll realize they don't need to keep doing these neurotic protective mechanisms anymore, and then they'll be looking for some new role or some new job, and this is the process of integration, so that's Step 6. [16:00.7]
Then it doesn't end. It's because there's Step 7. It doesn't end there. Step 7 is to train, to train consistent access to more of your higher self so that you can repeat Steps 1 to 6 again over and over, and each time you do it, you get better at it and it gets more fulfilling and more enjoyable, and more natural.
No matter their physical strength, for many men, emotions are too much for them to handle. It's why they can't give women the deeper levels of emotional intimacy and connection that they crave. It's why they fail to be the man that modern women desire most: a man with inner strength, a man who has mastered his emotions.
Find out how to master your emotions through David Tian's “Emotional Mastery” program. The Emotional Mastery program is a step-by-step system that integrates the best of empirically-verified psychotherapy methods and reveals how to master your internal state and develop the inner strength that makes you naturally attractive, happy, and fulfilled.
Learn more about this transformational program by going to DavidTianPhD.com/EmotionalMastery.
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Now, what I'm referring to in this episode is what you can do on top of the seven steps. Once you are able to access your higher self consistently and more of that energy of your higher self, your true self, you're already going to be attractive, because those qualities of being courageous and confident, and creative and having compassion, and calm and clarity, and playfulness, those and presence, those are already naturally-attractive traits. So, accessing more of your higher self, the energy of your higher self, more consistently will already make you a lot more naturally attractive. [17:57.0]
Then of course, on top of that, once you've unburdened the vulnerable exiled parts, there you will be holding lots of childlike qualities, like spontaneity and adventurousness, and being laid-back and easygoing, and being present, being fully there in the present moment and the quality of having fun. All of those qualities are already naturally attractive, so going through the seven steps will already make you very naturally attractive.
If you want to go even further, now, this is why I’ve dedicated this episode to what happens to what you can do after the seven steps, and I'm currently developing a course or courses that will help with this that will be able to guide you through the process using recordings.
I’ve already had the privilege and honor to do this live for my clients and for my coaching groups, and I am currently developing a way to make this process available through. Depending on when you're listening to this, hopefully soon, it will be available to you, hopefully, by the end of this year. If you want a taste of what it will be like, the process, what the process is like, you can get my course called Core. [19:04.1]
In Core, I have a guided-meditative process that leads you through accessing four archetypes, Jungian archetypes, and they are the king or the sovereign, the lover, the magician, and the warrior. The Jungian theory is that these are part of the collective unconscious. These archetypes are sort of passed down to us through our DNA, and archetypes are a special category of parts. This is not the norm, standard, or normal IFS therapy. This is like a Jungian IFS, and what I’ve found is that these archetypal parts are sort of unburdened protector parts.
Sometimes you find immature versions of them and then they are standard protectors who have taken on the roles of these archetypes, but they can either be unburdened and then step into the archetypal roles, or you can access the archetypes already within you, and then they can serve as unburdened guides to help you along in life and they serve these roles that are specific to them. [20:08.0]
You can kind of guess just by the names—like the warrior, you can kind of guess what role the warrior would play in your life. But also the lover and the magician are sort of like the creative, intellectual, and even humorous, because humor and intelligence track pretty closely or, at least, there's a strong correlation there. And your sovereign, the sovereign part of you, that sovereign archetype in you can help you with any leadership roles at work or your social circle, or in your family or with your partner.
Now, this is a great way of illustrating how other parts besides these archetypes can also step into attractive roles for you. Think about it in terms of personality traits that are attractive in men, sexually attractive for heterosexual men in the eyes of heterosexual women. I have an acronym for this, LASAE, L-A-S-A-E, to make it easier to remember, and they stand for leadership, assertiveness, being sexual, and then adventurous, and easygoing. [21:07.7]
Looking at these qualities, if you had these five qualities, you'd be naturally sexually attractive to women in terms of your personality, and hopefully, you can understand or see immediately how there are parts of you that naturally gravitate toward leadership roles and developing leadership skills, and are interested in being a better leader.
Then you also have the sovereign or king archetype in you that would also be a natural leader. So, right away, if you don't have natural leadership qualities or skills, the seven-steps process will naturally bring that out and develop that in you. But you can go even further by training or giving those parts of you that really like leadership more leadership training, because it's going to be sheer hard work, that is, they're going to have to put some effort into it, but they're going to love it. This is something that they naturally gravitate towards and are motivated to do, and enjoy studying and learning, and I believe that there are, in everyone, parts that would enjoy and gravitate towards leadership roles. [22:08.7]
The same goes with assertiveness. Now, assertiveness is often blocked by toxic shame, and this connection between assertiveness and toxic shame is pretty deep and I dedicate an entire module, a four-hour module to this connection between assertiveness and toxic shame in my course Rock Solid Relationships, because if you don't address the toxic shame that's blocking your assertiveness, you are going to have a failed relationship. That's why it's in the relationship course, and it's really deep.
Now, if you are able to work through your toxic shame and unburden, release, and let go of that shame, you're going to naturally be able to assert your boundaries much better. And the more practice you get at asserting your boundaries, the better you'll get at it, and there are very likely many parts in people that are capable of and enjoy being assertive. [23:00.0]
Then the traits of being adventurous and easygoing go hand in hand. They're often absent in nervous, nerdy guys. Okay, so this is a common type of profile that I see in students and clients, and they're not coming off as adventurous or easygoing, and maybe in their day-to-day life, they're not risk-taking in any way, and they're really uptight. Sort of the opposite, right, of adventurous and easygoing? They're risk-averse and uptight or anxious.
Once you unburden those parts of you that are full of fear and toxic shame, you'll be able to access these more childlike parts, or maybe even adolescent, teenager parts, that are adventurous and fully present in the present moment. They're mental states. What they're thinking and feeling are focused on the here and now, right here in the present, and that is a prerequisite to forming deeper emotional connections with women. [23:55.3]
So, there are parts of you that are already adventurous and easygoing, and with more practice and perhaps more knowledge about how to be present—I have a course called Emotional Mastery that trains people and how to be more present, be more mindful, how to regulate their emotions, how to be with any challenging or painful or difficult emotions whenever they come up and not have to repress them or push them away, but that you can be with them and aren't afraid of them so that they don't overwhelm you—you can actually train yourself in being assertive and being more adventurous, and being more easygoing. You practice at it, and there are parts of you that are naturally into it. They naturally enjoy it and they have some natural proclivity for it.
Then, finally, being comfortable with your sexuality. That's the final thing, being sexual, and being not just comfortable but adept at sexual energy. There are parts of you that are sexual—if you've gone through puberty, there definitely are—but that are weighed down by sexual shame and by toxic shame. [24:58.2]
Once you're able to work with those parts to help them unburden of the sexual shame, to let go of the sexual shame, then they will already naturally be able to or then you'll be able to access the natural sexual energy that they already have that has been locked up or exiled or disowned, or pushed away or repressed. But now it's there.
It's there. You just need to access it. It's sort of like gold and you just need to dig deep enough and then there it is, and you can actually refine the gold. That is, you can actually then, once you access it, you can train it and get better at it just through practice, but also through knowledge. If you want to, you can train in tantra and all kinds of other outlets for practicing and experiencing sexual energy and expressing it in different ways.
You might have already within you, as I discovered in myself, a natural rake or natural charismatic, or maybe you have a natural dandy or a natural charmer, and these are seductive archetypes, and I'm taking these terms from a great book—the first part of the book is great anyway—by Robert Greene called The Art of Seduction. The second half of the book is good if you understand the proper context for it. [26:05.3]
Just a recap, going through the seven steps will already make you more naturally attractive, because you'll be accessing your higher self, which is already courageous and confident, and all those other attractive traits. In addition, when you are unburdening the various parts that you discover, they will naturally access more of these attractive childlike traits of playfulness and adventurousness, and being able to have fun and being in the moment, and being laid back and easygoing.
In addition, what I'm pointing out is there are also parts of you that you can access and allow, give permission to become more of and step into more the fullness of their roles as a leader, and they'll be naturally more assertive and adventurous and easygoing, and you can encourage that in them and give them more experience being and acting and expressing those traits, and especially sexuality. [26:57.6]
There are parts of you that are already sexual, and once the sexual shame is removed, you're already going to be able to tap into that sexual energy, which is required for sexual attractiveness, by the way, in case you didn't know, and then you can also train in and get better at expressing all of these traits with more experience, more practice. The more you use it, the better you get at it.
There are parts of you that are already naturally talented at expressing these character traits, personality traits, and have these personality traits and can be cultivated to inhabit more of these personality traits. They can be more adventurous, more easygoing, be more comfortable with sexuality, be more adept at sexual energy, be more assertive and be a better leader. They will naturally be better at these things, the more practice and experience and knowledge they get in these areas. [27:47.3]
Then there are the specifically seductive archetypes like the rake or the charismatic or the charmer that, if you have in your system, would then get better as you allow them to be expressed and practiced, interacting with the outside world, and to get more experience—and I am currently working on courses or a course that will enable people to do this through a guided process and through recordings. I'm putting this out there in the world sort of also to hold myself accountable, and I hope I will be. I intend to, fully intend to do this by the end of the year.
Just to end off, I want to leave you with a story of my client, Derek, who went through this process. He started off as a kind of-- he was following pickup stuff and red-pill stuff. A lot of it was very what we'd call techniquey and tactics-heavy. He wasn't thinking at all in terms of personality or character traits. He was thinking entirely of what to say and what to do, mostly what to say, what to type, what to text.
Then he discovered my work and contacted me, and went through a coaching group and started going through the therapeutic process. As a result, he actually stopped. He recognized the toxic nature of that tactics-heavy kind of manipulative approach that he had been taking, and he stopped doing everything. [29:06.1]
But then what he did was he was able to, through the therapeutic process, the seven-step process, and then beyond that later, he was able to access those parts of himself that, for instance, really enjoyed fashion. He had repressed that, because in his home and his community, it was looked down upon for men to care about clothes or fashion, or to dress in ways that might capture more attention that are more flamboyant, maybe tighter clothes or more brightly-colored clothes, or clothes that it might be more haute couture, so to speak.
He discovered that he had parts that really enjoyed those, that enjoyed the of fashion and design, and he started going to art galleries by himself because he really enjoyed art and architecture, and so on, so he was able to access this aesthetic appreciation that was a natural part of him that had been exiled out of shame in his community, which was a kind of toxic-masculine community where he had to be macho and all that. [30:01.2]
He traveled for a period by himself, which was very cathartic for him, because it freed him up from having to conform to his peer group back home, which was, it turns out, sort of toxic machos, and allowed him to be however he wanted to be. He discovered these light, playful, adventurous parts of him also through the seven-step process, able to unburden them, discover and unburden them, but then give them more room to play and expressing them, allowing them to express themselves through his body, the things that he was doing and saying, and the energy that he was putting out, and then the friends that he was making.
As a result, he actually became a lot more playful himself and adventurous himself as almost like a default, because he really enjoyed being that way. And when he went back home, it was kind of jarring for him because the people that he used to change how he was, adapt himself for, like his family and his old friends, they thought he was being weird and tried to make him change, and he didn't. [30:59.0]
He wasn’t happy being the way that they wanted him to be, and as a result of the seven-step process, he was able to stay with those parts that were hurt now, after feeling rejected by his old reference group, his old peer group, and he was able to then assert these boundaries of taking responsibility for his feelings and not taking responsibility for theirs.
Then he worked through a process where he was able to let go of the resentment and anger towards his old peer group and family, and not require them to be any different from how they are in order for him to maintain some degree of connection with them and to accept them in his life, without allowing them so much room in his mind that they would influence him in undue ways.
After dating a few different women, he was able to find one that really connects with him or clicks with him, and that's where they're at right now. I'm not going to say anymore, I don't want to put any other pressure on Derek for where that relationship might go, but it's great to see that he's in a very grounded, centered place, and happy with himself and able to access these parts of himself that he didn't even know he had, because he thought he was forcing himself to be more attractive through taking on more toxic-masculine, toxic machoness of trying to be a tough guy and be more badass and manipulative. [32:15.2]
It turns out that that's not how he enjoyed being at all, and he had these parts that really enjoyed being adventurous and easygoing, and playful and spontaneous, and in a way, kind of engaging in a kind of innocent play, but still being able to confidently protect them from being taken advantage of because his higher self, his true self, was protecting them.
So, the other parts of him that were trying to be tough and conform and didn't enjoy those roles no longer had to do that and play pretend and put up a false front. Instead, he was a lot more attractive because he just dropped all that trying to pretend and please others. He just, in the end, didn't give a damn about what others thought of him, because he cared way more about treating his parts, his inner-child parts with love and compassion, and allowing them room to express themselves and to enjoy life. As a result, he naturally, as a side product, as a byproduct of that process, became naturally attractive. [33:12.7]
If this is something that you would want to experience for yourself in some way, being able to access those parts of you that are already naturally attractive, you can get started on the seven steps, the therapeutic process. Then, on top of that, you can go even further, if that's something you're interested in.
But let's not get ahead of ourselves. Let's just get you on the seven steps, because that is already going to take you quite far in terms of sexual attractiveness and it will, more importantly, lead to happiness, fulfillment, joy, and unconditional love, and that's far more important, in my mind, than being sexually attractive.
And, by the way, if you're experiencing those emotions in you, you'll naturally be exuding this kind of energy that will make you naturally attractive as well. But as this episode is pointing out, on top of that, you can access leadership qualities, assertiveness of being adventurous, easygoing, being sexual and having sexual energy, and be good with that. These are things that you can also grow and develop through the therapeutic process. [34:13.4]
Thanks so much for listening. If this benefited you in any way, please share it with anyone else that you think would benefit from it. Hit a like on wherever you're listening to this and leave a comment. Let me know what you thought of this episode. I love to read your feedback, and thank you so much for listening, again. I look forward to welcoming you to the next episode. David Tian, signing out. [34:32.5]
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